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Smifferific
O ho monster


Joined: 30 Jan 2004
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:57 pm    Post subject: Puzzle / Forum flip Reply with quote

Don't know whether it is feasible, but wondering whether it would be possible to go directly from the forum discussion on a puzzle to the puzzle itself (obviously assuming you have got that far!), and likewise from the puzzle to the relevant forum discussion (in fact that way is the more important!).

I realise that it is perfectly possible to have two windows open but when you have completed a puzzle, to get to the discussion forum you need to go back to the main menu to get to the new discussion area.

It would be a "nice to have" particularly when on slow connections

BTW - I'm really enjoying the challenge - Cheers

Smifferific
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bazza
Thy mothers name is ominous to children


Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Posts: 26
Location: Mile End Club

PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2004 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was about to post something along the same lines when I noticed a fellow puzzler had already made this point.

Is this feasible? I generally have at least three windows open - contest, current forum and the previous level's forum to gloat at (sorry, assist) those coming up behind.

Best regards Thumbs up
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bazza
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xyphic
Forum git


Joined: 14 Sep 2003
Posts: 2694
Location: Cambridge, UK

PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2004 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm. It would probably be possible, but very hard to do. I will have a look into it.
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arwin
Thy mothers name is ominous to children


Joined: 15 Feb 2004
Posts: 43
Location: USA

PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2004 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, I don't think it would be that difficult to do. Just put the link to the beginning of that puzzle's forum thread below each submit box. Now that all of the puzzles have threads started for them, this seems like the most logical route. And of course remember the "blank" tag so it pops up in a new window rather than closing out their puzzle page. As far as vice versa goes, I don't think that would be needed nearly as often.
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Stretham
Forum Hardass


Joined: 15 Sep 2003
Posts: 19348
Location: Here, there, somewhere, everywhere

PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2004 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem is doing it generically rather than going in and doing each one by hand. This is especially true as we plan to have future contests. More importantly though, I think the original question asked for the link the other way (forum to puzzle). Again this is something that is generically very difficult to do.

Stretham
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arwin
Thy mothers name is ominous to children


Joined: 15 Feb 2004
Posts: 43
Location: USA

PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2004 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes I see what you mean and did figure the other way round would be more difficult since then each link would have to know exactly what puzzle the user is personally on. And when it comes to PHP, I'm baffled.
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Nicky P
Soft and dull eyed fool


Joined: 26 Jun 2005
Posts: 3
Location: London

PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 4:55 pm    Post subject: Puzzle to forum (and back again) Reply with quote

Smifferific and others are right to demand game/forum/back-to-game/back-to-forum hopping. Your site structure assumes that people are either doing puzzles or are in forums, which simply doesn't reflect actual usage. Websites are supposed to be designed around the users: most of us start a puzzle, want to chat about that specific puzzle, seek help, offer help, whatever, and then go back to the puzzle. You guys who come up with these puzzles are definitely bright enough to solve this simple web problem. Basically, as a website it's not great. The puzzles are meant to stretch our minds, but navigating your site is not meant to be part of the puzzle. Or is it?
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Titanium22
your chamber lye breeds fleas


Joined: 14 Sep 2003
Posts: 12253

PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 5:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Puzzle to forum (and back again) Reply with quote

Nicky P wrote:
The puzzles are meant to stretch our minds, but navigating your site is not meant to be part of the puzzle. Or is it?

Has it occurred to you that you can have two browser windows open - one on the puzzle site and one on the forum...? Or that many people want to access things on the forum that are unrelated to either the puzzle or even the contest that they are currently on...?


T22
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Last edited by Titanium22 on Sun Jun 26, 2005 5:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
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hyperbit
Pernicious and indubitate beggar


Joined: 02 Apr 2005
Posts: 368
Location: Cambridge, England

PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A personal preference of mine (I use the firefox browser), is to have the forum on one tab, puzzles on another....etc

I also "bookmark" puzzles for easy browsing
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Stretham
Forum Hardass


Joined: 15 Sep 2003
Posts: 19348
Location: Here, there, somewhere, everywhere

PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 6:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Puzzle to forum (and back again) Reply with quote

Nicky P wrote:
Smifferific and others are right to demand game/forum/back-to-game/back-to-forum hopping. Your site structure assumes that people are either doing puzzles or are in forums, which simply doesn't reflect actual usage. Websites are supposed to be designed around the users: most of us start a puzzle, want to chat about that specific puzzle, seek help, offer help, whatever, and then go back to the puzzle. You guys who come up with these puzzles are definitely bright enough to solve this simple web problem. Basically, as a website it's not great. The puzzles are meant to stretch our minds, but navigating your site is not meant to be part of the puzzle. Or is it?

There are some very valid points in there, but one thing you need to bear in mind is that Puzzletome is a hobby for us to carry out in our spare time. If we were making money from the site (and I can assure you that the reverse is the case) then it would be fair to expect a whizzy interface that moved at the speed of light and had easy to find links to everywhere from everywhere else. Now I agree that we *could* solve these problems, as two of us are software engineers. But we tend to spend our time on (a) coming up with (hopefully) enjoyable puzzles, (b) helping some of our members come up with and test their own puzzles, (c) keeping up with the 'social' aspects of the forum, and (d) having a life outside of work and Puzzletome.

However, if someone would like to pay us to work on Puzzletome full time (and pay the costs of server/bandwidth) then xyphic and I would jump at the chance and we would promise to produce something world class. Smile 8)

Stretham
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xyphic
Forum git


Joined: 14 Sep 2003
Posts: 2694
Location: Cambridge, UK

PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We *have* considered doing this in the past, but with the current site software it'd be an entirely manual process. There's already enough legwork involved in setting up and testing a contest without having to cross-reference puzzles and forum posts. So, as nice as it would be to have this feature, at the moment it isn't feasible to do it.

As Stretham said, we work on the site in our spare time - and after spending all day writing software, it can be difficult to get motivated to do more in the evening. A complete rewrite of the site is underway; it's a slow process, but it's getting there. All suggestions (including this one) are being considered for inclusion. Certainly, something like this should be fairly easy to automate, as long as we factor it in from the beginning.
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Nicky P
Soft and dull eyed fool


Joined: 26 Jun 2005
Posts: 3
Location: London

PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Stetham and xyphic, Thanks for your replies. I will say no more on this topic for now.
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theandygrant
This is the foul fiend Flibbertigibbet


Joined: 07 Feb 2004
Posts: 1264
Location: The Lethargic Dodecahedron

PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow. NickyP, I don't know if you meant it as such, but you came across as very rude! Surprised
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Shiz
Pernicious and indubitate beggar


Joined: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 366
Location: Middle of England, Ex-pat Scotland

PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

At this juncture it's probably appropriate to offer a big round of applause, and a great heap of thanks, to Si, Stretham, T22 and Xyphic (in no specific order... well, other than alphabetical - I didn't forget anyone did I??) for all of the hard work that they do do on PT.

Having never explored the online world of puzzling before, perhaps I don't have a broad range of sites with which to compare this one, but I do have to say I have spent just over a year thoroughly enjoying this site (ooh... belated Happy Anniversary me!) and all the puzzles it has to offer, as well as the contact with many other members who you will find to be friendly and helpful, and prepared to assist you along the way if you ask nicely.

I've seen myriad evidence of the hard work that goes on to keep the site up and running, and deal with not only their own puzzles but the playtesting and hosting of other members' contests, as well as site problems, worm attacks etc.

Sit back and enjoy / appreciate the site and puzzles for all it has to offer, NickyP. You'll find that whatever you're prepared to put into it you will get back.
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Rebecca
Thou whoreson cullionly barbermonger


Joined: 16 Sep 2003
Posts: 128
Location: Perth

PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shiz wrote:
At this juncture it's probably appropriate to offer a big round of applause, and a great heap of thanks, to Si, Stretham, T22 and Xyphic (in no specific order... well, other than alphabetical - I didn't forget anyone did I??) for all of the hard work that they do do on PT.

Having never explored the online world of puzzling before, perhaps I don't have a broad range of sites with which to compare this one, but I do have to say I have spent just over a year thoroughly enjoying this site (ooh... belated Happy Anniversary me!) and all the puzzles it has to offer, as well as the contact with many other members who you will find to be friendly and helpful, and prepared to assist you along the way if you ask nicely.

I've seen myriad evidence of the hard work that goes on to keep the site up and running, and deal with not only their own puzzles but the playtesting and hosting of other members' contests, as well as site problems, worm attacks etc.

Sit back and enjoy / appreciate the site and puzzles for all it has to offer, NickyP. You'll find that whatever you're prepared to put into it you will get back.


My sentiments exactly. A lot of hard work has been put int ot this site both structurally and puzzlewise and being a fellow puzzle site admin I can appreciate their efforts. Let's just enjoy ourselves and get onto solving the riddles.
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